Mykhailo CHECHETOV: I’m grateful to opposition

Mykhailo Chechetov cuts a spectacular figure as a Ukrainian MP, simply because he is always ready to support even the most dubious initiative of the current regime with five-dollar words.

It is with a raise/wave of his hand, as a member of the Party of Regions, that a Ver­khovna Rada session is held, that its resolutions are passed. It is also true that his hand-raising-waving has won him a noticeably unpopular reputation in the Ukrainian parliament. Mykhailo Chechetov doesn’t give a hoot. In the following interview with The Day, he makes it absolutely clear that political ratings aren’t his headache.

My first question concerned the results of the ninth session of the Verkhovna Rada:

Mr. Chechetov, Speaker Volodymyr Lytvyn ended the ninth session, referring to it as the most productive one. The opposition has a different view on the matter. They refer to this session as one of the most corrupt and antipopular ones. What do you think?

“I think that this session ended on a po­sitive and constructive note. There were no pitched confrontations between the opposition and the ruling party’s factions. The opposition’s attempts to block the podium in parliament were meant to save the opposition’s face. And so they marched to the po­dium, occupied it, so what? We could have overwhelmed them and cleared access to the po­dium, but for what purpose?

“I’m grateful to the opposition for letting the previous year pass on a more or less stable basis. They had the election bill passed the way they wanted it and now they’re telling everybody about this being [Ukraine’s] most unbiased law.

“Let me tell you something. For the first time [after the Soviet period] Ukraine has a solid political system. We’ve always had opposition but no such political system. Of course, there will be people saying that this regime has done or is doing something the wrong way, that our government isn’t active enough. The fact that we have a solid poli­tical system remains. No one can prevent it from making decisions now.”

What about Gazprom? First, the budget bill provided for a new gas price, but the end result was the old price: 419 dollars per cubic meter of gas. Do you expect this price to lower in 2012?

“Destroying relations with Russia was very simple. It was also very simple not to sign the gas accords. Now trying to correct these mistakes is easier said than done. There is no alternative to the holding of consultations and waging talks on various le­­vels. Ukraine won’t step on the warpath, hard as we are pressured to do just that. We have to keep taking political temperature, in Ukraine as well as in Russia into consi­deration. Russia is running a temperature, which is something well to be expected, considering that there is slightly more than a month left before the presidential election date. Ukraine is only too well aware of the fact. As soon as Vladimir Putin is elected President of the Russian Fe­deration (this will be a single-round [landslide] election implying two terms in office), this temperature will lower to normal. After that, I believe, there will be no political excesses and emotional statements.”

Considering what you said at the start of this interview, the opposition went through the motions of doing something in parliament, just to save their face. By the same token it is safe to assume that Ukraine has an operetta parliament; that all major decisions are made on Bankova St.; that all bills are passed by our parliament with just one member raising/waving his hand. I mean your hand, Mr. Chechetov. Aren’t you bothered by this public political image?

“Passing bills [at the Verkhovna Rada] involves a special technology. I preside over a board of experts; during our sessions we discuss the next week’s agenda. Every MP is entitled to submit a proposal. We try to synchronize [coordinate] our stand with those of the Cabinet of Ministers and the Presidential Administration. In the end, I submit a given proposal to my faction in parliament, along with my progress report. My faction has the final say, passing a resolution and making it known to every MP.”

Apparently you have clear-cut decision-making procedures that, judging by your own words, are being carefully observed. How does this explain your hand raising and waving in parliament?

“The [Verkhovna Rada’s] audience is a noisy one, you can’t even hear what is being stated [from the podium], with some MPs looking away, others using their cell phones — under the circumstances, I have to act as a coordinator of sorts. That’s all I can say on the matter.”

Isn’t this status tiresome, considering that you have become known as a member of parliament who embodies its negative process?

“I’m not interested in ratings, I’m interested in teamwork. What makes a team strong? Awareness of one’s role as a member, placing the team’s interest first on one’s agenda. The Party of Regions boasts unique members, including Olympic champions, government-level top managers, dozens of governors, city mayors, academicians — people who have achieved success in their fields of endeavor. Each of them has his own views. There are also spectacular opposition personalities, but these people are playing solo; none of them are able to act as a team.”

Last Friday you waved a hand and fired Andrii Shevchenko as chairman of the VR Committee on Freedom of Expression and Information. Was this a team decision?

“It certainly was. This has nothing to do with politics. At one time we voted for him, although he wasn’t our man. He was professionally strong but a poor manager. A good manager often turns out to be a bad professional. I hold Andrii in esteem as an indivi­dual, a talented politician. This isn’t the first and last parliament for Andrii; he will have his chance as a good organizer.”

Talking of a solid team, last week your faction held a meeting and there were serious grievances addressed to Mykola Azarov.

“Watching television channels sometimes makes me laugh because I know what is actually happening off-screen. The producers must take their audiences for a bunch of dimwits.

“I was present [at the meeting of the faction]. What actually happened was an exchange of interesting ideas. In fact, I addressed the meeting and said it was one of the faction’s most productive sessions during the year. Now and then we call a spade a spade. This is good because there must be criticism in each team, otherwise this team won’t last long. The Soviet Union fell apart precisely because there was no such criticism. Our team members are sufficiently critical, but not after a decision has been made. Afterward, each and every one carries it out to a T. This is what makes us different from the opposition.”

There is something interesting going on within the opposition. They’re trying to unite against your regime, by forming a single majority slate.

“There is a new-generation opposition. Previously we had Yushchenko and Tymoshenko, people left on the side of the political road. Now we have Yatseniuk in place of Yushchenko and Korolevska in place of Tymoshenko. To prevent the Batkivshchyna Party from collapsing, the older generation should step down and pass the banner to Korolevska.”

Do you really think that Korolevska can be Tymoshenko’s adequate replacement?

“Tymoshenko is no longer there. Much as I respect Yulia Tymoshenko, her spin doctors have done their utmost to end her career that way. She was forced to play the game by their rules.”

Yulia Tymoshenko can hardly be regarded as a person who would play a game by anyone else’s rules.

“There are no irreplaceable persons. Chechetov as coordinator will be replaced by another one. The irreplaceability complex is the worst that can happen to a politician. We’re witness to a [political] generation change. In this sense, Korolevska and Yatseniuk are the young blood, both are interesting, attractive, well-educated, erudite individuals.”

I don’t know about Korolevska, but I know that Arsenii Yatseniuk won’t like your compliments, he will think that you’re working on another frame-up.

“Why, for heaven’s sake? I’m a politician, but I also hold a Ph.D., I’m a university lecturer, dean of a faculty. I have a group of postgraduate students. I enjoy dealing with the younger generation. I enjoy watching ta­lented boys and girls at work. I hate dimwits.”

Weren’t you shocked, as a fellow human, to watch Yulia Tymoshenko being transferred to a penal colony at 6 a.m., on New Year’s Eve?

“As a fellow human, I wish she never got there in the first place. I have always tried to see good traits in every individual and justify that individual’s actions, even if disgusting at times. I feel sorry about Yulia Tymoshenko and Yurii Lutsenko.

“On the other hand, Tymoshenko was Prime Minister of Ukraine. What kind of impressions about Ukraine will the international community get with such corruptionists in high offices?”

The court had no evidence that Tymoshenko had personal motivation or self-interest. I just can’t visualize Putin giving her an attache case packed with greenbacks as a bribe.

“I’m not a lawyer, but I can figure out that Ukraine is paying several billion dollars extra to Russia. With this money we could have increased our wages and sa­la­ries, pensions for the Afghan war and Chornobyl veterans. Why aren’t we paying them? Who has stolen their money? The one who made the gas accords [with Russia — i.e., Yulia Tymoshenko. — Ed.]. There may have been undercurrents when signing the papers. I don’t know.”

Much has been said and written about these accords. Kyiv hosted a Ukraine-EU summit (December 19) that was supposed to go down in history. It never did. Do you really think that getting even with Yulia Tymoshenko justifies Ukraine losing its European prospects?

“We must have self-respect. What is the difference between this and the previous administration? Eighteen years ago, Ukrai­ne was like a ball being kicked around on the political field, we were subject to, rather than a member of, international power plays. Then the situation changed. From now on Ukraine will play the game by its own rules. There will be no room left for double standard. I spoke to Americans, asking what would happen if President Obama called a judge and told him to throw someone behind bars and release another one. Their reply was impeachment.”

In other words, Justice Kirieiev and the Court of Appeal are in the way of Ukraine’s European integration effort?

“What does Justice Kirieiev have to do with the matter? He handled the case in accordance with Ukrainian legislation. I don’t think that Ukraine needs the European prospects of becoming another ball being kicked around by anyone in the field… Ukraine will act in a way that best serves its interest.”

Can you visualize the French or the US President ordering his political opponent thrown behind bars?

“I can’t visualize this situation in our country.”

Granted: Everything is nice and dandy in Ukraine. How about Tymoshenko beating Yanukovych by three percent in terms of pre­sidential ratings?

“Thank God, we now have a man who runs this country and pays little attention to his ratings, because over the past 20 years Ukraine has failed to match its economic indices registered in 1990; because the previous three presidents were politicians who worried mostly about their ratings. Each realized that this country had to be upgraded on the largest possible scope, but that this was an extremely ungratifying process.

“Pension reform. This isn’t our invention. Look at what’s happening in Europe. Practically every European nation is aging, Ukraine included. The older generation is increasing, as is the burden on the central budget’s old-age allowance appropriations. A crucial decision has to be made. Retirement age has to be prolonged, the way it has been prolonged elsewhere in the world. Another unpopular decision [by the current admi­nistration of] Ukraine.

“Taxes. Practically every country has a shadow economy, varying between 7 and 12 percent, compared to Ukraine’s 50 percent. How to get this country out of the sha­dow? The simplest solution to this problem would be to make everyone’s incomes public know­ledge. This proposal raised hue and cry because Ukraine was on its way to Europe. No way.”

How about the president’s incomes? The revenues Viktor Yanukovych used to have his luxurious mansion in Mezhyhiria? How about his eldest son getting rich and finding his name on a list of Ukraine’s Top Hundred Rich Men?

“His eldest son runs a business.”

His business is suspiciously profitable.

“Let me give you an example. Kostiantyn Zhevaho. He is younger than the president’s son, yet he is a registered Ukrainian millionaire. A young and talen­ted fellow. He ought to vacate his seat in the Ukrainian parliament and live happy ever after. It’s extremely important for every individual to find his/her field of endeavor, be it business, politics, journalism, pop art, science. This is normal!

“There is an important process underway in Ukraine. Business is being separated from power. There is a top-class business league in this country and I’d name between five and six people there: Rinat Akhmetov, Viktor Pinchuk, Ihor Kolomoisky, Oleksandr Yaroslavsky, and Kostiantyn Zhevaho. All these people are estranging themselves from politics. The lower business strata should follow suit. In other words, under President Viktor Yanu­kovych business has started living a life outside the political realm. In the West, a clear line is drawn between business and politics.”

There are other trends. First, the pre­si­dent is distancing himself from influen­tial political figures, trying to keep the reins in his hands, allowing his close and dear ones to have the key posts. Second, there are Ukrainian political refugees.

“There is no denying living high on the hog. Some want to live like that in their own country, others prefer to live elsewhere.”

Arsen Avakov and Oleksandr Tymo­shenko had to flee Ukraine for apparently other reasons, didn’t they?

“Sometimes a media publicity campaign doesn’t match the person it is focusing upon. Okay, someone left [Ukraine] and settled in the Czech Republic. Why not leave him be? Maybe the man likes it better there. Ukraine is a free country, unlike the So­viet Union whose borders were closed and closely watched.”

Ukraine is more often than not referred to as a hybrid regime, not as a democracy. This year will see another election campaign. The Party of Regions has determined the winning electoral districts, in the southeast of Ukraine, and the “bad” ones in the west of Ukraine. Do you have a candidate in Lviv who could compete with Tiahnybok? How can this problem be solved?

“This problem must be solved by people. Why do we have a mixed [electoral] system? A proportional one reduces competition. Our electorate numbers 36 million while only party members — about two million — can be nominated. In other words, Lozynsky or a pedophile could get a seat in our parliament, but a normal individual couldn’t.

“This time our parliament will be substantially rejuvenated. You won’t recognize it. There will be new people and I believe their professional level will be considerably higher owing to the majoritarian electoral system.”