Oleksandr Kupchyshyn:
<h2> There can be no teachers and pupils in the Council of Europe</h2><p>
Ukraine, which joined the Council of Europe three years ago, is being accused of breaking the rules of the game – no moratorium on death sentences was enacted in our country for a year and a half.
Does anybody still trust us after this? Does Kyiv use all its opportunities for further cooperation with the Council of Europe, our window on the West? This was discussed in The Day’s interview with Oleksandr Kupchyshyn, Ukrainian Ambassador to the Council of Europe.
Q.: Mr. Kupchyshyn, does Ukraine have some problems in its cooperation with the CE?
A.: There are problems. Ukraine cannot be put on an equal footing with developed countries more experienced in sense of democracy. Of course, there are more claims made on new members – states that have recently taken the road of democracy – than on traditionally democratic countries. However, as Ambassador, I am trying to keep such a policy in the CE: there are no and cannot be teachers and pupils, professors and students in the CE.
Q.: This January there was a proposal to exclude Ukraine from the CE Parliamentary Assembly since it does not keep its promises regarding the death penalty. Is it still valid?
A.: The point is that Verkhovna Rada should adopt a legislative document stipulating a de jure moratorium on executing death sentences or abolish the death penalty as such. A moratorium on death penalty has been in force in Ukraine for a year and a half. Thus, the CE demand to adopt a legal document abolishing the death penalty is not sufficiently correct because it is not applied to other countries. Almost twenty states (for instance, Great Britain and Baltic states) do not carry out death sentences, although they have no laws to this effect. And nobody says anything to them. But we are not trusted, since for a year and a half after Ukraine entered the CE people were being executed in our country. I think that should Protocol Six to the European Convention on Human Rights be submitted to Verkhovna Rada for ratification it would not pass since our society is split regarding abolishing the death penalty.
In this situation Ukraine’s parliamentary delegation could temporary be denied its vote in Parliamentary Assembly. There is no question of Ukraine being denied membership: this is within the CE Committee of Ministers competence. Several months ago we managed to get the Committee of Ministers to open a special account in the CE aimed at helping Ukraine abolish death penalty. The money will be used to build new prisons and maintain life prisoners. The fact that the CE opened this account indicates that it does trust Ukraine and believe that the moratorium is in force here. But should even one death sentence be carried out in Ukraine after opening the account the situation for Ukraine would become seriously complicated.
Q.: Until Ukraine entered the CE there were many items in the press about it. Why is information about Kyiv-Strasbourg cooperation now so rare?
A.: It seems that three years ago we replaced to some extent the notion of integration with that of entering. We thought that if we simply entered the CE, everything else could be ignored. This is why there is less talk about CE in Ukraine now. But it is full membership in one or another organization, in this case in CE, that can open a variety of opportunities for integration. I do not think it is possible to integrate with the EU, NATO, or OSCE without the CE. We need to cooperate with all those structures at once since all of them has its own dimensions, its own niche in the system of European security. However, no other organization opens for Ukraine such possibilities for cooperation as the CE and perhaps the OSCE. Because we have a vote, we are able to propose issues for deliberation in our own interests and as a full member we place our people in secretariats (however, they can still be counted on the fingers of one hand).
Q.: Is not the CE like the UN afflicted with nonpayment of membership dues?
A.: Now even our country despite all the difficulties with its financial situation regularly pays fees — nearly 15 million French francs per year (less than $3 million). We would not like to be the first country in the CE causing such problems.
Strasbourg-Kyiv
